Senate Bill 1254 passes house committee Friday
BOISE — Senate Bill 1254, the hot-button bill that would allow concealed firearm carry on state university and college campuses, passed with an 11-3 vote in the House State Affairs Committee Friday following almost seven hours of public hearing.
Representatives Lynn Luker and Eric Anderson were absent from the vote. The bill will now move to the full House floor with a recommendation to pass.
The public hearing began at 8 a.m. in front of the House State Affairs Committee. Bill sponsor Sen. Curt McKenzie, R-Nampa, introduced his bill to the House committee with history of similar bills. House Bill 222, raised in 2008, brought forth a similar issue but was voted down due to what McKenzie said was the “expansiveness” in its language.
Committee Chair Rep. Thomas Loertscher said he would give special consideration to testifiers from out of town, but did not set a time limit for individual testimony.
McKenzie introduced the bill by describing a series of nine myths commonly heard in conversations surrounding S.B. 1254 — from denying university administrators’ statements concerning major fiscal impacts this bill would bring forth, to refuting claims the environment of immaturity, alcohol and drugs when combined with firearms will play a role in increased violence on campus.
“Would you rather no one be able to be armed and able to defend themselves in the basis of a murderer?” McKenzie said. “You would be in more trouble from law enforcement (if you were carrying on a gun-free campus) than in the face of the murderer themselves.”
Based on Idaho’s Constitution, McKenzie said, there is no way to completely remove the right to carry. He said university officials can only ask you to leave campus grounds.
Boise State University student Kelly Monks gave testimony in support of the bill. Monks said he was leery of what BSU President Bob Kustra said was average local police response time — anywhere from 30 seconds to two minutes.
“Why do they have policies that make us reactive instead of preventive?” Monks said. “Lives can be taken for about 30 seconds after the shooting begins. And most people who use firearms know it does not take 30 seconds to empty an entire clip.”
University of Idaho Interim President Don Burnett spoke on behalf of UI as well as the Council of Higher Education Presidents, of which he is chair. Burnett said incoming UI president Chuck Staben is also in disapproval of the bill.
“This bill would still cut back the authority of post-secondary institutions to decide what is best,” Burnett said.
He said it’s not effective policy to create a statewide mandate without considering needs of individual universities. He aid UI has more than 70 campuses across the state, and having the power to regulate safety needs to be addressed on each individual campus.
“My experience and common sense tells me bringing loaded firearms into our classrooms (and) laboratories is simply not a good idea,” Burnett said. “We encourage you to take our concerns very seriously — continue making Idaho campuses some of the safest in the nation.”
Burnett said the bill could be improved if individuals with concealed carry licenses would register with the Office of the President.
Boise school teacher and concealed weapons permit holder Callie Sands said it’s unfair to be barred from bringing her gun in the primary place she would be a target: the classroom.
“I’ve spent countless hours in the gun range in case I ever need it,” Sands said.
She said arming students is the only way for them to protect themselves in case of a mass school shooting. Sands said the legislators trust constituents to vote and elect their leaders, and should extend that trust to the responsibilities that come with a concealed weapon.
“It’s not like we don’t know what our rules are for concealed carry. We know what we’re doing,” Sands said. “You trust me to teach you kids, why can’t you trust us to … know what to do? We’re not children — we’re citizens with a long-standing tradition of defending ourselves and our loved ones.”
Moscow Police Chief David Duke made the trip to Boise to testify in disapproval of the bill.
“We routinely respond to fights around the Kibbie Dome,” Duke said. “Bringing firearms on campus is an extremely dangerous idea.”
Duke said the risks out weigh any benefits, and that combining the environment of sporting events, alcohol, high tension and school population with firearms raises endangerment of accidental discharge of guns as well as other risks.
Don Soltman, president of the State Board of Education said the bill does not support any of the state’s goals for increasing the number of Idahoans with degrees in 2020, or for increasing the graduation rates on college campuses.
“It is not about the Second Amendment, the court has ruled there are places where the right to bear arms can be regulated,” Soltman said. “Please consider the serious negative consequences of this legislation.”
Associated Students of Boise State University Vice President Cassie Sullivan said the bill discriminates against students living in residence halls because they have nowhere to store weapons and the bill states residence halls are prohibited concealed-carry areas, leaving those students defenseless.
Kent Nelson, general counsel for the Office of the President at UI, said the bill could hinder the ability of universities and colleges to hire and retain quality staff and faculty.
“It’s unclear how this bill would affect contact with employees — as discussed we have security guards but they are not armed — employees would be prohibited from having a policy from electing to carry themselves. If this law passes — we have no choice but to increase training.”
Mark Browning, vice president for community relations and marketing of North Idaho College said implementing increased security and training would cost the college from $221,000 to $300,000.
“The fiscal note (attached to the bill) says it would cost little just for signage — but it would be for much more than that,” Browning said. “Keep in mind local control and local authority is at stake here.”
Bryan Lovell, representing the Fraternal Order of Police and President of Idaho’s State Lodge said he supports the bill and that it’s clear campuses are open places — security checkpoints and the ability to check all visitors doesn’t exist. He said allowing guns on campus increases security for students and faculty.
“There’s nothing in place to prevent someone who wants to break the law from entering a campus — if they’re intent on breaking the law they’re going to do it,” he said. “Regardless of any laws or any rules.”
He said if an individual is comfortable with the responsibility of being armed and willing to protect others, they should be able to do so. He said getting a concealed carry permit is no easy feat, and those who are dedicated to receive one are taking on responsibility.
“Some people are going to be irresponsible,” Lovell said. “But people getting these permits have to understand there are responsibilities there and consequences … bottom line, law enforcement is dealing with that already.”
Lewis-Clark State College President Tony Fernandez said violence on campus is not a persistent problem in Idaho, especially not one that must be treated by adding firearms to the equation.
“There have been some truly horrific incidents — leaving some to conclude college violence is on the rise,” Fernandez said. “But data makes it very clear, college campuses are very safe.”
ASUI President Max Cowan said it is a difficult feat to represent the diverse needs of the more than 9,000 students at UI. Cowan testified in disapproval of the bill not as a basis to remove gun rights, but to stand in opposition of the state bearing sole decision-making power.
“I can say that this bill removes our power to be parties, with our institution, to make our own policies,” Cowan said. “I ask you to vote against this bill and trust in us enough to make the decision for ourselves.”
Rod Lewis, secretary of the State Board of Education, expressed concern for the Open Carry language in the bill.
“What happens when a student enters a classroom and sets their gun on the desk?” Lewis said. “Not much learning will be taking place in that classroom today. Most likely, some students in that classroom would leave … possibly even the professor.”
Lewis said the bill would have many unintended consequences that could hinder the future of Idaho colleges and universities.
“And good luck getting parents to let their children stay in dorms that allow the same scenario,” Lewis said. “Good luck recruiting talented athletes.”
ASUI lobbyist Ashley Morehouse also testified, but as a student rather than an ASUI representative. As an individual with a concealed weapons permit, Morehouse is experienced with firearms and has been trained in multiple areas of defense.
“I believe this is a conversation that needs to be kept close to home – our students need to be involved,” Morehouse said. “I think it’s much easier for the students to be involved when (the conversation) is happening with our administration rather than here at the Capitol.”
Morehouse said she would no longer be interested in attending any Idaho institution if the bill passes, and other would do the same.
“If this bill would have passed when I was a freshman or sophomore, I would have transferred to an out-of-state institution,” Morehouse said. “If this legislation passes I am no longer considering higher education in Idaho.”
President of College of Southern Idaho Jeff Fox said legislators need to consider specific needs of individual campuses. Fox said satellite locations and the presence of youth programs on campus make them unsuitable for concealed and open gun carry.
Following three and a half hours of testimony, the House committee was needed on the floor and forced to take a break from hearing. The session resumed at 1 p.m. in the Lincoln Auditorium where the testimony continued for almost three more hours with testimony both for and against the bill.
Ryan Jenks, Boise attorney and UI alum, said the bill would create real security changes on campus. He recalled the violent shooting of Katy Benoit by assistant professor Ernesto Bustamante in 2011.
Jenks said he was shocked all administrators at UI did to increase safety following the shooting was create an opt-in program that would deliver texts in case of a campus emergency. Jenks said the texting program is a frivolous matter when lives are at risk. Jenks said students have been stripped of their ability to protect themselves for too long, and as a certified firearms instructor he said those with a concealed carry license are prepared for the responsibility.
“This isn’t something that’s forced upon them,” Jenks said. “These are people who are actively and safely exercising their Second Amendment rights.”
“Students have this right just as much as everyone else,” said Nick Ferronato, BSU student and president of the Young Americans for Liberty. “Feel-good policy does nothing to prevent crimes from happening in a gun free zone. Criminals don’t care about the law.”
Sen. McKenzie closed the hearing with a short rebuttal. He said he was surprised by the newest arguments added to the bill’s quo, including the debate surrounding open carry on campus and the fiscal responsibility attached to the bill.
“We don’t represent large companies or organizations,” Mckenzie said of the opinions of SBOE and the presidents’ council. “We represent individuals.”
Chloe Rambo can be reached at [email protected] or on Twitter @CRchloerambo